Voices: In the band biography, you're quoted as saying that you have no musical influences, but in recent interviews you talk a lot about Joni Mitchell.
Fran Healy: Yeah, when I heard the Blue album, that was the point where I was kind of like, "I'd quite like to do that." I don't know, it just inspired me. It's like seeing a good exhibition, a good painting, or a good piece of work, and it just kind of gets you going, gets you inspired. Joni Mitchell--fantastic, she's the greatest. In fact, she was in my dream last night. It was her and a woman that looked dead like her, and I don't know where it was, it was like a venue or something, and they were giving me the eye. They were checking me out. So I was quite into it, well in the dream. But we're going to L.A., and as you know, Joni's one of the "ladies of the canyon." So we might run into her.
V: At your show, when you introduced the song "More Than Us," you tried to explain how the meaning of the song had evolved, but you gave up.
Fran: Yeah, it had to do with the fact that I don't know what it's about, to be honest. And every night I try to hazard a guess as to what it's about, but it's a bizarre song. All the songs are bizarre. The thing I was trying to point out was that you write a song, and the meaning comes after the event. There is a definite theme that runs through songs, but as to what the actual meaning is, you only find out once you've finished it. It's like receiving messages, if you know what I mean. That's kind of what it's like, really. Because you don't really have any idea what it's going to end up like until it's finished. It's weird, it's like being given something, and you just write it down. That's the way I do it. Some of the better--or the best--songs that you write don't feel like you've written them.
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"When I heard the Blue album, that was the point where I was kind of like, 'I'd quite like to do that.' It inspired me. It's like seeing a good exhibition, a good painting, or a good piece of work, and it just kind of gets you going, gets you inspired. Joni Mitchell--fantastic, she's the greatest."
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V: So you write most of the songs by yourself?
Fran: I write all of them by myself.
V: You've also been quoted as saying that too many artists write songs with their heads, when they need to write with their hearts. How do you do that?
Fran: You just have to sit and wait. You just sit, and you wait, and you wait, and you wait. You're sitting with a guitar or a pen or a pencil or whatever. And you're sitting and you're writing, and you're writing, and you're writing, and you're writing. And eventually, something happens. And that's usually when a good song happens. And it doesn't feel like you've done it, you know? And therefore, you haven't done it from your head. A lot of bands write from their heads. Like the new Radiohead album. I think The Bends is a better album than OK Computer. It was a lot more personal. OK Computer, sonically, it's a brilliant album, I'm not saying it's their worst album or anything; I'm just saying I prefer The Bends.
V: So are most of your songs personal?
Fran: Me, I think it's like a tea bag, and you're the tea bag, and all the tea leaves within the tea bag are all the little experiences you've had. Then the hot water comes in, and what you're left with are the songs or whatever. They've been drained through the tea leaves. But I don't know where the hot water comes from. That's what it feels like. I feel like a tea bag. It may not be your cup of tea, and it may not be someone else's, you can't choose what cup of tea you have, you can't choose what experiences you have in your life. But I kind of like the taste of my tea.
V: How do you feel about your sudden change of audience size? When you were opening for Oasis, you played to thousands. But just the other night, there was about 40 people at the show.
Fran: I don't know, it's weird. Someone said to me the other day that it's harder going from the big ones down to the small ones, rather than going from the small ones to the big ones. But then again, it doesn't really matter, because you've got to start somewhere, and somewhere is usually at the bottom. You never ever start from the middle or the top. If you start at the top, there's nowhere to go. If you start from the bottom, there's somewhere to go. Yeah, it's cool, I don't actually mind it. I just enjoy getting up on stage in front of one person or ten thousand people, I don't care, as long as there's someone there to listen.
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"I think it's like a tea bag, and you're the tea bag, and all the tea leaves within the tea bag are all the little experiences you've had. Then the hot water comes in, and what you're left with are the songs or whatever. They've been drained through the tea leaves. But I don't know where the hot water comes from. I feel like a tea bag. It may not be your cup of tea, and it may not be someone else's, you can't choose what cup of tea you have, you can't choose what experiences you have in your life. But I kind of like the taste of my tea."
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V: So you enjoy touring?
Fran: Yeah, I love it. It's good fun. But sometimes, it just hurts my throat. So that's that.
V: In many of the early reviews of your album, you were compared to Radiohead. Do you think that early comparisons to established bands help or hinder bands that are just starting out?
Fran: I don't think that they really matter. Because when a band establishes itself, as itself, which eventually all bands do, then all the early comparisons are forgotten. And the comparisons are only there at first to provide people who have never heard of the band before with a sort of an idea of "Is this your cup of tea?" It kind of sounds like a Radiohead cup of tea, or it sounds like an Oasis cup of tea, or whatever. So therefore, if you like that kind of music, then you'll be into this. So that's all it's there for, so it doesn't really matter. I don't think it hinders or anything, it probably helps in a way. A lot of bands kind of go, "Oh, I don't like that," but you can't avoid it.
V: What about interviews and all the other things that go along with it--does it ever wear on you?
Fran: No, 'cause I mean, you sit and you dream about maybe getting in a band and getting a record deal or whatever and getting to do what you love doing all the time. So to be in that position is amazing. I don't think any of it's bad, I think all of it's great. The interviews are a bit tedious at times, especially in the U.K. There's a lot of interviewers in some places--like, Germany is really terrible for its interviewers. They're just idiots. They really are. They're just not interested. They just don't give a fuck. I don't have any attitudes--well, I may be a shit, I don't know. I think attitudes suck. All this "He's fucking brilliant" and all that stuff, the "I'm too good for you" kind of thing. A lot of interviewers have that. They think they're the stars and not the band, and they probably get into doing interviews for the simple reason that they never were talented enough or whatever to get in a band. So therefore they've got to do that, and they take advantage of it, which they shouldn't do because no one remembers crap journalists. They only remember good journalists, and good journalists are usually enthusiasts who understand your position and understand the band's position and know where everything lies. But I don't know. You and go round and round and round, and you get asked the same things all the time, which isn't the whole event of you, or anyone. They're just kind of general things that people have to know before you can pass go.
V: There's a consistency to interviews.
Fran: But that's the problem with artists--they're not consistent people. I think for the journalists and the press to expect consistency, you can forget it. If you look at John Lennon, he'd say one thing one day and then say something that contradicted it completely the next. That's just the way artists think. They shouldn't be expected to be lateral. Politicians have to be consistent; they're always being interviewed, if they change what they're talking about then they get in trouble. But bands don't; you can say whatever you like.
V: When you started the band, you dropped out of art school. Did your family support you?
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"That's the problem with artists--they're not consistent people. I think for the journalists and the press to expect consistency, you can forget it. If you look at John Lennon, he'd say one thing one day and then say something that contradicted it completely the next. That's just the way artists think."
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Fran: Well, it's just me and my mum, really. Yeah, to begin with, it was only art school, it's not like going to university to do a proper course. The support really, it's not so much support, it's just your parents, or your parent, making sure that you do something that you enjoy doing, compared to what they had, which was doing a job because it was money and that's it. There's no enjoyment factor to it. There's no fulfillment in your life. I think my mum just wanted to make sure that I had what she never had. And she has. I thanked her on the inside of the album cover, but you owe your parents more than things like that. They're far more important.
V: What about British and American audiences?
Fran: I think it's still the early days. The differences between British and American audiences are not much. It's the similarities that run thick between bigger cities that are spoiled from music, like New York and London, and the similarities that run between cities that aren't so spoiled from music, like the little towns on the outskirts of places. It's all kind of similar. Huge oceans don't change generally what people are deep down. They'll react the same, pretty much, as the next.
V: What are your impressions of America?
Fran: New York's great. I love the fact that you can go there and sort of stand about and feel like you're somewhere else. New York's just different, it's not America, I don't think. It's something totally different. This is America--I'm in Kansas, this is much more America. This is what I would think America was like. It's really kind of cozy, and the bar I'm in is one of the coolest places, actually. It's got a big aquarium and lots of little lanterns up. Mostly, the decor is red and sort of a dark color. And there're red light shades above the bar with red bulbs in them, and it looks top, brilliant. And the stage is great. It's all the little details.
V: What's your favorite part of it all?
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"I think my mum just wanted to make sure that I had what she never had. And she has. I thanked her on the inside of the album cover, but you owe your parents more than things like that. They're far more important."
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Fran: My favorite part is getting an opportunity to sit down and write. And concentrate on that, concentrate on the writing side. Because if you don't get a chance to do that, then why are you doing it? The point is, as a painter, all your job is, is creating all the time, and not regurgitating. But the job of being a musician is doing the creating side, and then also kind of constantly, well, regurgitating is maybe not the right word, it's kind of negative, but just going out and doing gigs, I suppose. That's the difference between the two. The thing I prefer is actually doing the making part. If I had the opportunity, I'd rather just sit and write all the time and get someone else to do this part. I'm a painter; at the end of the day, that's what I am. And I can get up onstage and look cute and do that, but at the end of the day, where I want to be in 20 years' time is not on a fucking stage. Not on a stage, doing what I'm doing just now. I want to be in Italy, with a studio, and I want to be painting, and I want to be having kids and a family, you know?
V: Why Italy?
Fran: I love it. Have you ever been? It's beautiful. Italy's amazing. I was there last October visiting a friend, and the lifestyle's amazing. The food's amazing, and the sunshine, and they're really cool people, you know. They got a cool lifestyle. They don't get drunk, they sit out, they talk to each other, they drink coffee all day. It's brilliant.
V: You went to art school and painted and did other things. Why did you eventually settle on music as your means for expressing yourself?
Fran: A song was the first thing I ever finished. I was painting, but I never ever finished any paintings, but a song was the first thing I finished. And that's what I ended up doing because of that. If I had finished a painting first, then I'd probably be a painter. I don't have enough time or concentration to paint anymore. It takes a lot of concentration to be a painter, and I don't have that. I have little or no concentration. That's why I think books really get me, because I can't keep on them. If the author does something I don't like, then I just fucking put the book down, and that's that, I'm not having any more of that.
V: Do you do any writing while you're on the road?
Fran: Yeah, yeah. I just write journals, and I write long postcards to folk I know back home. And it's just a way of not letting all the things that you're doing pass you by. You just have to record them somewhere. That's the whole thing--I like the idea of painting and writing and all these things are all just forms of recording. You know, recording moments, albeit a fictitious moment or whatever. It was all written down at a point in time, so I do journals, and I cut lots of things out and stick them into my book and make it look cool. I write loads of stuff, just little daft things. What I do is I just write things down and write as much as possible and just keep on writing and writing and writing, and not so much songs or whatever. If you write all the time, then when it comes to doing something that's a little more concise, like the three or four lines of the verse of a song, if your vocabulary is lubricated having written all the time, it usually does you quite good. The really bizarre thing about having your stuff published, be it songs or whatever, you've got to be absolutely sure that it's good because if it's not, you're going to make a total ass of yourself.
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"The drummer from the Pretenders, Martin Chambers, he described the sound of our music as 'simplicity with weight,' and I thought he was quite accurate. He said we made him remember why he did this in the first place."
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V: What do you want people to take or get out of your album?
Fran: Oh, god, that's a really, really tough question you ask. I don't really think about stuff like that. I just want people to enjoy it like I enjoy it 'cause I'd like to think I've got really, really good taste. And therefore, if I've got good taste, then people should get it, you know what I mean? I throw a lot of stuff out. I think 90 percent of the time you write shite stuff, and the other 10 percent of the time, you actually do something that's worth putting out. You've just got to do it all the time. That's why a lot of British bands are losers, because in a lot of respects, there's a lot of lazy songwriting. And I think that if you look at the songs that we've put out so far, there's an effortlessness about them that's only gotten through actually doing it kind of really, really well. And it's something that's overlooked because it looks effortless. Some think, "Oh, that's easy to do, anyone can do that," but it's not. It's actually really quite hard to be that simple. Trying to think simple about things is just so difficult. I find it difficult because I always think dead complex about stuff. Like I said before, if it was up to me, I'd sit in the room just writing songs and doing that, that'd be good. But there's the performance side of it, and there's a lot of stress involved in it, every night having to worry about your throat and having to worry about what you're doing. And the state of your throat has a lot to do with how good the songs are, because a lot of songs are written around someone's voice. Mention any kind of great song or song that you like. It all has to do with the voice and how the voice makes the vowels and how the vowels sound and then the words form around the vowels. It all has to do with the voice. Everyone's like, "Is it not dead stressful having to write songs?" And it's not. The more stressful part of being in a band is, for me anyway, just making sure my voice is together. And tonight it's not. But I'm not going to go out and play a set at half pace. I'll always go out and do it 100 percent, and try my absolute top. If there're 20 people there, then it'll be the same as if there was 10,000.
V: So you like the reaction you get from the crowd?
Fran: Yeah, it's great. But you know, some days I love doing what I'm doing, other days I really hate it. And today I really hate it, just because I've got a sore throat. That's the one thing, I just always want my voice to be good, because I hate seeing bands when you know the singer's not making the notes, and you just don't enjoy it as much. It has to be effortless. Every part of what we do has to seem effortless. The drummer from the Pretenders, Martin Chambers, he described the sound of our music as "simplicity with weight," and I thought he was quite accurate. He said we made him remember why he did this in the first place. With Travis, because of our attitude towards the whole thing--and we don't have much--we may be a bit boring for some people. But we're not so much interested in the big rock star thing. We just want to fucking go out and give people a good night, a night they will remember without fucking putting on makeup or wiggling our bums too much. Because it's much more important than that. The other thing as well is when the band's not there, what bands do you remember? I mean, people generally really only remember a few bands like the Beatles and a couple other big bands and solo artists, as well. More than that, it's the music that lives on, it's the songs that live on. When the artists have all died and disappeared, it's what they leave behind that's more important than they themselves. As a painter, you get the painters who stand in front of their work and try and make themselves more important than the work, and it goes back to talking about the journalists who couldn't get in a band, so they become journalists who almost assume the rock star position instead of doing what they should do. Fame is, well, I don't know what fame is. I don't know what fame is yet, and I hope I never do. 'Cause I've seen it happen to people, and talking to Liam and Noel [Gallagher], Liam was saying that you can't ever let your fame get in front of you, you've always got to keep it behind you at all points. It's a weird thing, I'm not really interested in that. I think everybody's got a little bit inside them that would be like, "Mmm, that would be top, wouldn't it? To be famous." But the closer I get to it, the more I can smell it, and it doesn't smell too good.
V: Do you interact much with your fans?
Fran: Yeah, we talk to everyone, but I find it bizarre that anyone wants to actually talk to us, do you know what I mean? You may call it modesty, but I just don't particularly think anyone would want to, you know. Maybe I should assume a different glow and become a bit more fucking rock star-ish about it. But it's just me, you know, after all.
V: Are you going back in the studio any time soon?
Fran: We've only just started. We always go into the studio when we can, and we always try and keep that side up. But it's difficult to find the time 'cause you've got to do so much touring. So we're trying to get in the studio next June and July to do the second album. It's too far ahead, I can't even think of tomorrow, I just got to think about tonight. When you come on to this side of things it's just all, well you've got to be organized. Well, I don't need to be organized, you got other people around you, you pay people to be organized for you. Your managers and your record company, they get everything sorted out, so it's cool.
V: Is it hard being away from home?
Fran: No, no, I mean I don't really have a home, you know, 'cause I'm from Glasgow, and I moved to London. I never really felt at home anywhere, you know, if you're on the move, it's the kind of thing like you're on a bus and that's where you belong. On the move. There's people that have toured for like 40 years, some of the old school people, and their life's just been on the road, and that's an outrage. I mean, I know I don't want to be doing this. I only want to do this for 15 years or 20 years. And I've already had 6 years at it so there's only another 14 years to go. I don't want to do it any longer than that because I think there's other things I'm good at. I've been just one of those people that whatever you put your hand to you're not bad at, you're quite good at it. And so I can put my hand to quite a few things. I'd like to do the painting thing. Finish a painting one day. That should be a good thing. The ideal situation would be to make absolute fuckloads of money doing this and then not ever worrying about having to get a shitty job. Because I just don't want to do that.
Chicago Maroon
November 25, 1997
by Renee Tyndell
You may not have heard of them before, but you will soon. Their single "All I Want to Do is Rock," already established as a hit in the UK, is starting to get American radio play, and the video is almost impossible to miss, what with MTV's enthusiastically relentless programming M.O. The Scottish foursome known as Travis is poised for an American breakthrough. With the release of their debut album Good Feeling, an easy blend of vibrant, bounding pub rock and bare acoustic ballads, Travis won the much-envied position of opener for Oasis on their most recent European tour, building a devoted European fan base in the process. Live, Travis are all dimpled smiles and seemingly endless enthusiasm, bouncing from song to song. The perpetually disheveled singer/songwriter Fran Healy belts out Travis's deceptively simple lyrics with intensity and sincerity.
